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Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
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vie
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.

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So what's the etiquette for when your adventure suffers a suggestion drought? Anyone got any advice for or experience with that kind of thing?
06-16-2017, 10:10 PM
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NonAnalogue
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
Stay fresh!

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When that's happened to me, I wait a few days to be sure, then I just go with what the most likely action would be based on the last update.

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06-16-2017, 10:16 PM
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Tuesbirdy
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.

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I've only been here awhile, but I've asked kind folk on discord to throw me suggestions for a thread before. I've also seen people just... Carry on with the story and break at a more engaging decision point. Sometimes that's all it takes!
06-16-2017, 10:21 PM
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Dragon Fogel
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
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I usually just ask; just not on the forum.

Taking a look at your adventure, the issue may be the question you ended the last update with. It's a weird question, and doesn't seem to have a lot of relevance to the situation - whatever we answer, the next update is probably going to involve waking up. So it's not clear how any answer is going to affect what happens next, which is the main point of suggestions.

In this case, it might be best to just do another update and try to end with a clearer prompt.
06-16-2017, 10:42 PM
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Zephyr Nepres
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
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One thing I really like about Tuesday's Sixteenths is the way those question prompts are done. Instead of just asking "how do you react to what's being done/said" it asks questions which are more specific and add atmosphere. An example is a recent update where one of the other main character asks the current MC for his men to battle alongside them. Instead of just saying "how do you react" it asks "why is this a terrible idea?". For an adventure so focused on short but succinct updates it helps greatly because it guides the commenters while not completely railroading them, allowing for the author to maintain some control.

Does really cute mice people, vibrant characters/backgrounds and the most adorable art style you've ever seen interest you? Read Great Haven.

Have you ever wanted to save a bunch of kids from dying horribly in a nightmare dreamscape? Read Lucidstuck
06-16-2017, 10:58 PM
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bigro
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
Please explain

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(06-16-2017, 10:10 PM)vie Wrote: So what's the etiquette for when your adventure suffers a suggestion drought? Anyone got any advice for or experience with that kind of thing?

Depends on the tone of the adventure and the context, sometimes a lack of suggestions is suggestive in and of itself. Really often comes down to how suggestable* a specific situation is. If there's only really one thing a character can do, or if it's super obvious what is going to happen, there's no real need to suggest. I'm basically just rewording what fogel has said here anyway. A good way to avoid this I think is to ask yourself before you update, "could a suggestion change what is going to happen in a meaningful way." If not, just keep going with the story until it could. We all do it sometimes, don't fret too much, and as fogel said it's super easy to just ask folks to suggest. No harm in it.


*I'm trademarking this term.

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06-17-2017, 12:12 PM
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vie
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.

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Thanks a bunch for all the feedback. Just continuing the story on your own was what I figured the move would be, just wanted to make sure I wouldn't be committing some sort of social faux pas.

In retrospect I can really see how the prompt was poorly worded. My original thought process, iirc, for ending the update there was that I wanted to telegraph that I was planning on ending the scene so that readers would have a chance to ask/do anything that they wanted to at the last second before the dream actually ended. Also I figured that if the amnesiac was going to wake up anyway, it would be more fun to spend an update or three on a weird dream logic way to wake up than just writing 'and then you wake up'. Obviously that didn't end up playing out.

So I guess the problem is that I didn't realize it would come across as a situation where player input didn't matter. I should have been more explicit about my intent re: giving a last chance to do dream stuff. Like I said, looking back I can totally see how someone would come to Fogel's conclusion about lack of agency. And in the end no matter what the guy was waking up eventually. But on the other hand, the suggestion I did get made the waking up process- and what came after- take a totally different turn from what I set out expecting to write, so I can't say that the readers didn't actually have power.

Actually though, this discussion works a perfect springboard into a tangentially related topic I was wondering about! How do you reconcile character consistency with reader agency? For example, in my adventure, two characters are attempting to enter a city. There are lots of valid ways to try and do that, and other things to explore in the meantime, but ultimately- assuming that they don't fail completely which admittedly could happen- no matter what path they take the end result will be about the same. They'll be in the city. This is just by virtue of the fact that characters have goals and are unlikely to act in ways that would go against them.

Additionally, there's the matter of the fact that different in-universe personalities would react differently to suggestions, or even refuse some outright. That also limits how much effect the readers can have on a much more immediate basis.

So what are different ways of resolving this conflict? Personally I've kind of found that over time readers tend to give more 'in character' suggestions, so does that aspect of the issue just kind of resolve itself? What about the matter of long-term character goals- is it actually a problem at all or just a fact of certain styles of adventure?

I'd be interested in hearing other peoples' takes on the matter.
Edit: holy fucking shit this is a lot of text sorry
(This post was last modified: 06-21-2017, 02:22 PM by vie.)
06-21-2017, 02:22 PM
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wyatt
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
clown brown from downtown

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forum tips: Keep your art quality to a medium so you can make consisent and fast updates but still keep your reader engaged with charming art
06-29-2017, 09:15 PM
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a52
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
Comander obviou's

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I'm kinda new to this whole "actually serious adventure" thing, and I already need some help (or at least some feedback) on Perception. Is the prose too purple? Am I giving enough room for suggestions? How can I give more? How do I deal with having too much backstory and too little plot?
(This post was last modified: 09-09-2017, 04:34 AM by a52.)
09-09-2017, 04:29 AM
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Justice Watch
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
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You're doing just fine, as far as I can tell. The prose is easy enough to understand, and making an early habit of giving explicit prompts is good for suggestions. I would do the same, but I'm already several chapters into my adventure, and I value consistency in writing more than I do suggestions.

Don't be afraid to go all Tarantino on our asses and use flashbacks and non-chronological storytelling; maybe your backstory IS your plot.

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09-09-2017, 12:10 PM
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vie
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.

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Re: Perception: It seems good so far, I don't think the prose is too purple at all. The figurative language is descriptive and purposeful and doesn't seem to drag the narrative down or get in the way.
I also agree that if the backstory is more important or interesting you could consider going fully non-linear with the narrative if you think it would be a good way to explore those past events.

So, I feel like I've put up enough stuff on Eagle Time that I feel okay with asking for some feedback on Reforge (specifically the current stuff on ET more than the super old and pre-ET bits). This is the first big creative thing I've ever done, and I don't have any clue what I'm doing!
Any tips on how to write unique character voice? Also, how do you do tone? Because I feel like my adventure always ends up all over the place in that regard.

I guess I don't know much specific advice to ask for, it would just be nice to kind of get a feel for what's working here and what isn't, especially given that it's getting close to the end of the current chapter I think and a chapter break seems like a good time to modify formatting/writing/art if I have to.
09-19-2017, 03:51 AM
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kilozombie
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
vaccinate your beetles

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I feel like I do a somewhat bad job at presenting interesting options for CHIRAL suggestions. People who do make suggestions have really great ones, it's just that it's tapering off in frequency, and I think it's out of lack for obvious routes on what to do.

Any thoughts? I might change some things up somehow to help with this, but I dunno if I'm off the mark here.
(This post was last modified: 11-12-2017, 08:24 AM by kilozombie.)
11-12-2017, 08:21 AM
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caliginovsCvre
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.

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I know this is an old thread, but I have kind of a question about adventure writing. Is there a such thing as taking your adventure too seriously? Back on the MSPA forums, I felt like I might have made the tone of my adventures too straightforward and boring, and didn't have enough of a sense of humor about things my characters said/did or funny suggestions the readers made, and the readership of my adventures always dropped off after the first few updates. Do you guys have any tips on balancing a "serious" tone without making it too boring?
03-11-2018, 03:30 AM
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Justice Watch
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
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I write a pretty serious tone adventure, but I balance it out with a cute art style and occasional comic relief. Don't be afraid to make jokes or take joke suggestions, but use your best judgement to determine whether or not it would be appropriate. Maybe the previous scene was really emotionally draining, so a joke or two would help lighten the mood. It probably wouldn't be appropriate in the middle of that scene, though.

But, in my experience, seriousness is not much of a determining factor for readership. If you have a small number of people suggesting on your story, chances are your readers are just having a hard time coming up with suggestions, which is a different animal altogether. The key to avoiding that is to have something interesting happen every update - if nothing has changed, or there is nothing to respond to, you probably won't get new suggestions.

In the end, I think the biggest thing you can do for yourself is just have confidence in yourself and your writing ability. The best way to improve is to practice, and I'd say just being aware of your shortcomings paves the way for improvement. Just keep trucking, and the rest will follow.

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03-11-2018, 05:06 AM
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Dragon Fogel
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.
The Goddamn Pacman

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If the suggestions are seriously out of line with what you're willing to accept, the thing to do is just say that. The audience here is pretty understanding.
03-11-2018, 06:44 AM
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caliginovsCvre
 RE: Critique and Advice; the treadmill of adventuring.

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Thanks for the advice guys :) Things are going ok with my new adventure so far, I was more referring to past experiences and how to avoid those pitfalls. I'll try to make sure that something is happening each update and let people know if the suggestions don't fit the tone.
03-11-2018, 04:38 PM
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